Ep #286: Turning Objections into Value with Sarah Hall

Welcome to the Make Money as a Life Coach® podcast where sales expert and master coach Stacey Boehman teaches you how to make your first 2K, 20K, and 200K using her proven formula.

Hey coaches, welcome to episode 286. Today I have a really special podcast interview with one of my students from my 2K for 2K program, Sarah Hall. She had posted in the 2K for 2K group about some of her results that she was getting and what she learned to create them and she shared 20 things that I want to share with you. And I want to dive into some of them on this episode because I think what she shared was so valuable. And it’s such a great topic for coaches who want to make money on consults.

So why don’t we start, Sarah, with introducing yourself, who you are, how long you’ve been a coach, who you coach, anything else that you think is relevant to the listeners.

Sarah: Okay. So yeah, I’m Sarah Hall. I have been a coach for a couple of years. I certified almost to the day a year ago and launched my business in September last year and then went full-time in my business in January. So, I’m in the first kind of nine months of my business. And I’m a general life coach, so I help all the people with …

Stacey: All the things.

Sarah: Yeah.

Stacey: Well, it’s kind of long, I know, but do you mind if I read your post and then we can go from there and I can ask you some more of the granular questions. I don’t want you to have to remember all the 20 things that you wrote in the group. So, I’ll just read them and then we can dive into some ones. I’ve circled them, the ones that I thought were really meaty. They were all good, but there are some that I really want to dive into.

Okay, so here’s what Sarah said. She said, celebrating my first 20 consults, plus three no shows, 87% show rate and completing all the evaluations in my copy of the consultation code printed out on my little inkjet printer at the end of last summer. I love that. 12 yeses and eight no’s, 60% conversion rate. She then went on to say here are 20 things I’ve learned and now think about me and consults. So here they are, everybody listen.

Consults are an opportunity for connection. Consults, bring clarity and the way forward. Not everyone will work with me, but a consult is always time well spent. I can now do consults without feeling nervous. I love meeting each new person and it’s such a privilege that they want to talk to me about their lives. I have a clear, effective framework to follow. I have adapted it to suit me and I use it flexibly to suit each situation. It’s not about me or the exact words I use. I’m getting better and better at bridging the gap.

When I focus on establishing what the problem is and why it’s important to them, I do. When I think it’s simple, it is. When I think I can help, I do. I’m good at figuring out objections. I’m great at delivering the price clearly and with confidence. I know it’s such good value. I see the value to them of me coaching on their objections. I’ve coached some clients through their objections and into coaching and they’re getting results. I’m willing to coach on objections and get it wrong.

I learn and get so much value from each consult. No one consult will make or break me. Thanks Maggie Reyes for this favorite, shout out to Maggie Reyes, I can create consults, I’ve created 20 and I can do that and more again, people want to work with me. This was such a good list. When you hear it back, what comes up?

Sarah: I’m just thinking, yeah, that’s all true.

Stacey: So good, I love that. This is where I want to start because I’m curious to hear your perspective on this. I absolutely love when a coach reaches this point. Because I think in the beginning when you start your business or for a lot of people, they’ve been at it for a long time and just the time it took them from really not understanding consults or not feeling like they’re great at them and being really nervous. People can do that for years and years if they don’t figure out how to get better at them.

Which is so much about what I want to talk about here on this episode because you did so many, you did all the evaluation sheets that were available to you and the consult code. So, you’ve really shown that you’ve transformed your ability in this skill set. And so, I’m just curious to you knowing what it was like and in such a short timeframe, nine months, I think is in the scheme of things is very short. To go from beginner coach to this person now who is a coach who feels confident to do consults, confident to overcome objections and really sees the value. Can you just talk about that for a minute.

Sarah: Yeah, I mean, it does feel like a huge transformation in a relatively short period of time. I remember doing those first couple of consults and it feels like five minutes ago really. And when I think back to it, the way that I felt was completely different so, it does feel like a lot has changed. And now since posting that I’ve done more. So, I think I’m at 24 with three booked in. And I’m really sort of seeing the benefit of all the practice and all the learnings.

I just did one a couple of days ago and I think really for the first time, I got that. You know, when you talk about explaining the problem better than they understand it themselves? And I really did that and I asked him, “So what do you think, does this sound like what you’re looking for?” And he said, “It doesn’t sound anything like I thought I was looking for, but it sounds exactly like what I need. You’ve hit the nail on the head, this is what I need, but it wasn’t what I thought I needed.”

It’s a huge change to go from just being kind of rabbit in the headlights, not knowing what I’m doing to kind of feeling like, you talk about it’s slower. And I can pay attention and see what’s going on with them and talk to them about it, rather than kind of running to keep up.

Stacey: Yeah, that’s what it feels like. I think in the beginning, it feels like you’re chasing after the conversation. And then when you develop all these skill sets, it feels like you’re miles ahead of the conversation. And then the person is kind of running to catch up with you, but in a good way. They’re like, “I want to be caught up with this person. I want to be where this person’s knowledge level is for my own life.” Which is so valuable.

Now that you have this skill set and you’re actively doing consults and signing clients, what do you think the difference is for you moving forward now that you have this skill set under your belt? How does it impact your daily business?

Sarah: I think really it impacts the way that I feel on consults and the way that I’m doing them and the success rate. When I look back, the 60% conversion rate, but the first 10 it was 50% and the second 10 it was 70%. So, you can just see in the results that it’s increasing. But it also makes me more confident with the organic marketing and getting consults and creating consults because as well as having confidence in my coaching, and I have confidence that just having an hour’s conversation with me is going to be helpful.

And so, I’m noticing I’m just doing more of that and I’m doing different things and I’m getting quicker at that.

Stacey: Yeah, that’s so good. And if you think about it, in your day-to-day work, I remember there was a time where I was telling, he was my fiancé at the time or maybe we were just dating. But I said, “I’m going to go do this consult and sign a client.” And I didn’t say it in this way, it just felt matter of fact to me. I’m going to do a consult. This person’s obviously going to work with me.

And to me that translated into, I no longer spend my time worrying about the consult coming up, over-planning for it, stressing in between consults whether we have to do a follow up or whether they said yes, but I’m not really believing they’re going to pay. And all of that time then went into meeting more people and doing more marketing and getting more consults and then closing more people.

And then that confidence just upped my production, the quality of my production, how much I could get done, what I got done, how many people it impacted. And it felt like that’s really where it started to take off.

Sarah: That’s definitely what’s happening now.

Stacey: Yeah, that’s so fun. Okay, so let’s dive into some of the things I circled that I think are just worth a deeper look into and hearing your experience on. I really love this. When I think it’s simple, it is. I would love for you to share about this because I think so many coaches are coming in and I think it’s not a thought, I think it can be really overwhelming and complicated to learn something new from scratch.

And so, it requires us even without knowing how to do it, to decide to think about it simply, to decide I can do this simply. I can understand this. I’m capable of understanding it. And the more you can work that, to get to that when I think it’s simple, it is, it’s so impactful. So, I’m curious your thoughts about that and how you would describe how you worked towards that.

Sarah: Yeah, I wrote that down as the most important, the biggest part of it, I think for me.

Stacey: Interesting yeah.

Sarah: There’s the two sides of it. There’s the me thinking that the process is simple, what I’m doing is simple. The consultation process, the just being a coach, what I’m doing, I have a simple plan. I have a simple process. And that’s what 2K for 2K has given me. That’s what I wanted after I certified was what’s going be my way forward. And that’s what I’ve got from this program. And so, it’s thinking about what I’m doing. This is a simple process. Then it’s also about seeing their problem and the work to solve it as simple.

Stacey: Yes. I think this is why people struggle. So, for those of you that are not in 2K, we have a five step consult process. And one of those steps is called bridging the gap. And that’s really where you’re taking a lot of information in from the client. You’re doing lots of listening. We have exercises that we teach on how to get this information from the client, but you’re essentially doing most of the consult is listening. And then you’re telling them, really, hearing back, showing them what their deepest problem is and maybe they haven’t actually spoken to it.

That’s where you’re explaining their problem better than they understand it themselves. They think it’s all these other things. It’s other people. It’s their boss. It’s all the circumstances. It’s the time they have in their lives. And you find the actual root problem. And then after you explain to them why that’s the root problem, then you go to work to show them what your specific coaching will do to them to bridge their gap and get them to where they want to be.

And I think that people struggle with bridging the gap so much because when they’re listening, they are getting overwhelmed. They are telling themselves, I’m not sure what the problem is. They’re getting, maybe lost in the story, letting the person lead and go down all the different tangents and rabbit holes. And it does become very difficult then to kind of pull everybody out of the weeds and get back on the path. And so, I think it is so powerful to be reminding yourself in this moment, this is simple. If I were going to make this simple, how would I make it simple to this person? That’s the key.

Sarah: Because typically the client is thinking, it’s complicated, it’s hard, it’s difficult, it’s impossible.

Stacey: And so, they’re not going to buy from a coach that agrees with them. And listen, we’ve all done that. We’ve all been listening and been like, “Oh my God, this seems so overwhelming.” I will tell you guys a trick that I do and I’m curious if you have any, but a trick that I do when someone presents something, because sometimes people present things that you haven’t solved a million times over. And so, it may not land as a super simple problem.

A lot of sales things and marketing things land for me as super simple, but some of the other things that people bring even to the live coaching, sometimes my initial reaction could be easily, this feels really complicated or big or it’s whatever. And what I will do and this is not the only reason I do this, but I will say, “I want to grab some circumstances in my brain.” And I’ll start asking questions to get circumstances. And the circumstance for everyone listening is a measurable factual result that everyone would agree on.

If someone said to me, “My business isn’t working, I’m thinking of quitting.” I might say. “Okay, how much money have you made in the last 12 months?” And you would be surprised at how many people don’t say zero. They might say 100K. And then you’re like, “Oh, interesting.” So, the more circumstances I get, even for me that helps kind of calm my brain and say, “Okay, so there’s thoughts and then here is the meat, this is the facts I have to work with to at least start to develop what that process would look like?” Do you have any tricks that you do or anything that would be helpful in this regard?

Sarah: I think for me in my thinking it’s just taking a minute and reminding myself that it is simple because there’s always the thoughts and the circumstances. And I know I can help with the thoughts and I know that that’s really what the problem is no matter what the actual situation is.

Stacey: So whatever thoughts they’re having, that’s the actual problem is the thoughts, no matter what experience they are coming to you with, which is so good. This was also a big breakthrough for me early on, is I thought when I did consults that I had to be the person that changed all of their circumstance, that knew the answers to changing all of their circumstances. But some of the circumstances they wanted to change in their life were not things I’d changed before or I had specific knowledge on or whatever it is.

When we think I have to solve this circumstance in this person’s life, meaning if they say something about their spouse and their spouse’s behavior. And they’re like, “I have to try to change the spouse’s behavior.” That’s when it starts to feel really complicated, when we’re like, “There are some thoughts, we don’t know what they all are, but these will all be solvable.” And we know if we do solve them their experience changes whether their circumstance does or not.

And typically, the circumstance does change in my experience, but their experience of the circumstance has to change first. So that’s a really good one. This is all just their thoughts and we can fix those.

Sarah: Yeah, and that’s usually part of my bridging the gap is the first thing that we’re going to do is we’re going to help you to manage your thinking, manage your emotions so that no matter what’s going on around you, these things are happening. Your spouse is doing that. This is happening at work. No matter what’s happening you feel in control, [crosstalk] of your experience.

Stacey: That’s so good. I do think what we’re supposed to be doing is promising that we will fix all of those things. I really love to be sold, even for myself on, I don’t know if we can fix all these things. It’s just there’s always going to be things. There’s always going to be these life stressors. When we help you become someone who’s in control of all of the life stressors, all of life gets easier. And instead of solving for all the individual circumstances, let’s help you become a person who just knows how to rise above all circumstances. That’s so brilliant. You said that’s so, so well.

Sarah: Because that’s what coaching has done for me. I just experience my life differently than I did before. And I have changed lots of the circumstances, but then lots of other things have happened as well and I’ve had exactly to deal with those. But the biggest thing is that I have that sense of control over my experience rather than these things just happen, and I’m at the mercy of them.

Stacey: Yeah, I love it. I love that you said, I’m good at figuring out objections. This is the part where people are like, “I don’t even want to talk about objections. If they don’t bring it up, I don’t want to bring it up.” So, tell me, what makes you feel confident in figuring out the objections? What’s been the key for you there?

Sarah: I think there’s a key difference between I’m good at figuring them out. That doesn’t necessarily mean I’m always going to overcome them, but I can kind of separate the two out. And because I do evaluations, even when I haven’t figured them out in the sessions earlier on. And then always been able to go back and work out what the real objection was and so that then helps me to be able to do it in the session.

Stacey: Can you give me an example of that, that you remember, one where you didn’t figure it out on the call and then you figured it out how you would say it again in the evaluation and maybe were able to use it successfully in the future?

Sarah: The main one that happened a couple of times, was that the real objection was about them believing in themselves really, believing that it would work for them. And that on the call we didn’t really get to that because I didn’t ask the questions.

Stacey: What questions would you have to ask them to get to that?

Sarah: Well, I often use that question on a scale of one to ten, how committed do you feel now we’ve had this conversation to doing this work? And what’s the gap then between the number they give me and what would make it a 10. And usually there from whatever they say, you can figure out where the doubt is. Whether that’s because I’ve not been clear enough in the process and it’s more about how the coaching works and that’s the objection or it’s more about them and the possibility that things can change.

And so, I think I’ve gotten better at having that conversation. Then when it’s clear that it’s lack of belief, we talk that through. And sometimes that’s just about me having belief and sharing that a little with them and doing a little bit more on the creating the vision with them so that they can kind of see and feel that more strongly. And then that with my belief gives them that greater sense of yeah, that is possible, or it could be possible.

Stacey: Yeah, that’s so good. That’s the time, really, I always say the consult isn’t the time to coach. But this is the time for coaching to shine is when they’re in that space of lacking belief. That’s what our job is, is to hold belief for them and to believe in our process, to believe in ourselves, to believe that even if they don’t have any belief in themselves that we will get them there. Okay, that’s where we’ll start. We’ll start with building your self-confidence or whatever it is.

I also think that one of the ways that could be useful for people to think about this or what I’ve been saying lately is you’re not ever going to hear the real objections until you feel confident, open and ready to hear them. You have to create the safe space for them to say it. And I don’t think you can do that when you’re afraid of the objection, when you’re afraid that they’re going to have a thought about your coaching or a thought about you, or that they don’t have time or that they don’t have the money or whatever it is.

If you’re afraid to hear that, it’s very hard to create enough safe space for that to come out and to get to the heart of it. And then maybe if you do, again, if you make it about you and not about them, that’s where the difference of figuring out an objection and overcoming one. It’s very difficult to overcome one when you are feeling personally attacked by it and making it about you. So, I really love this one and I think this is the one that I was like, “People are going to be like, oh, what?” I see the value to them of me coaching on their objections. Let’s talk about that.

Sarah: Yeah, because at first I was like, no, I’ll just have to do this without doing that bit, the nervous [crosstalk]. I’ll just not do that step and I’ll just get as many clients as I get from the other [crosstalk].

Stacey: When you were thinking that though, what were you thinking? Because now you see the value of it, but when you didn’t want to have to do that and you only wanted to sign the people who didn’t have them, do you remember what you might have been thinking about that?

Sarah: Definitely something like I just can’t possibly do that, would be in there. But yeah, something about it being, yeah, too salesy or something that just wasn’t me, just an approach that just didn’t fit.

Stacey: I think some people think they’re not my best client if they have objections. They’re not an ideal client because ideal clients shouldn’t have objections. And I always think that’s also not true because all humans have a brain and our brains offer us objections all day long to all the things that we think that we should do or would be better for our lives.

Sarah: Yeah, so, what was the other part of your question, what am I thinking now?

Stacey: Yeah. What is the difference, what is the value? If you were to break it down and teach someone the value of coaching on someone’s objections to the client, not to you, but to the client, what would it be for you now that you have gotten good at doing that?

Sarah: Well, ultimately, the objection is the barrier, isn’t it? It’s the barrier that exists between them and coaching. Therefore, them and getting the results that they want, making the changes that they want. If the objection is nothing to do with me, it’s just part of what I’m figuring out, I’m figuring out where they are, where they want to be and what’s in the way. And so, the value to them was finding that together what’s in the way and overcoming it, which is the first step to them making the change. Overcoming the objections is the first step to them getting the result.

Stacey: Yes. For everyone listening, I think that first step, no matter what the objection is, I think their first step to getting what they want is believing they can get it. And that typically is what they don’t believe, which is why they offer an objection that maybe isn’t even that one in the beginning. Some people, they’re more self-aware and they’ll just say, “I don’t believe I could do this. I don’t trust myself.” Some people will say that and other people say, “I’m going to go talk to my spouse.”

I have seen so many conversations around this where people say, “But yes, but we just have a deal where any amount over this amount we talk to each other and it’s about respect.” And I just never found that, not just in my consultations, but I never found that in my own life when I am fully believing that I’m going to get a result. I might be telling my husband, I’m going to do it and I’m going to spend this money and this is how I’m going to spend it and why I’m going to spend it and what I’m going to get from it.

Now, of course, I’m a lot more experienced so he’s used to this by now, but even in the beginning. But I think that extra layer of, I’ve decided to sign up for a consult so I already know I’m going to spend some money. I already know I want to try to pay to solve this and get some help. So, in the moment, the conversation is just very different when the person believes I can do this and I’m going to do it and I’m going to get the results. I just think then the decisions become so different. It becomes I’m a yes, send me the payment link.

And then I don’t even need to tell the person I’m going to run it by my husband. I’m going to do that anyways, but I don’t need to tell them I’m going to do that. I don’t need to wait for time and permission because, of course I’m going to do that, but I don’t need to do it as a determining factor of whether I say yes. Not to make it a rant about that but I’ve just seen so many people get kind of caught up in, no, it’s a value system. And then I’m like, “But even if it were, I think all humans are capable of saying yes and deciding and then going and having that conversation.”

I think the need to have the conversation and the buy-in comes from, I don’t know yet so I want to talk it by somebody else.

Sarah: And that’s part of figuring out the objection, isn’t it? It’s not necessarily the first thing they say. It’s then what comes up when you ask them some more questions about that.

Stacey: Yeah. And for me, on the consult, what I always wanted to do, and this is true for even the selling I do now, is I just want to make sure what I can be in control of and what I can be responsible for is helping someone believe I can do this. And knowing even if they’re still a little bit shaky there, this person’s got me. They’re going to show me the way to success, but also they’re going to help me through the failure. And if those two things happen, I just think everything else gets easier from there. So good.

Okay, so you said, I’m willing to coach on objections and get it wrong. Let’s talk about that one because I think that one is very scary for people. They want to get it right or they don’t want to do it at all.

Sarah: And then that really comes from the last one. Seeing that it’s for them and that it’s actually the first part of the work. Then, of course, I’m willing to do that because that’s what I’m here for, that’s what this is about.

Stacey: Do you have an example of getting it wrong? What would getting it wrong even mean to you?

Sarah: I think just starting to have the conversation and then not feeling that I was in a fully clean space, that I was starting to want them to say yeah. So not necessarily kind of saying the wrong thing or going too far, but just noticing that I was making it about me. And kind of being willing to do that and learn from a no that I did it. And then be able to notice it in real time and be adjusting it and then noticing that I’m not doing that. I’m not attached to the outcome.

Seeing that progress then makes me even more willing to keep doing it because I know that it just gets easier and easier, and I’m just going to be less likely to get it wrong the more I do it.

Stacey: Yeah, I agree. I think that’s where the evaluations really come in, that are so important, because then I get to look at and I’m sure you experience this. But when I do catch myself or when I did catch myself going a little bit over, I don’t even have a specific time but I think for me it was always, you can say the same thing, but one way it’s laced with love and one way it’s laced with judgment.

I’ve even coached someone recently in 200K on this where she was talking about the women that she coaches and how they were all kind of making excuses for how hard it was. And she was saying, “Well, it was really hard for me too and I said yes, and I did this.” And I was like, “Yeah. And I want you to start thinking what a miracle it was that you said yes to yourself. And each time you said yes to yourself and each time you figured out the money or each time you figured out the timing, each time you went for it.”

I think of each time someone says yes to themselves, especially for something like coaching or therapy, any time someone says yes to getting help on their mind or their emotional body, I think that’s a miracle. It’s so against everything that a lot of society teaches or how society runs and it’s so intimate. And it’s, I think, a miracle when we think I could have something different than I have now and I’m going to go for it. And so, I was just talking to her, the difference of how you might be talking to them when you’re in judgment versus when you’re believing, I did it every time but it was a miracle that I did.

I think back to my brain selling mops in Walmart and doing a consult call with The Life Coach School from a Walmart parking lot. I look back and I’m like, “Who did she think she was?” She was like, “Yeah, I’m going to go to The Life Coach School and get certified.” I think that’s a miracle. I don’t ever think, I just did it right or I was braver than other people or I was more courageous. I’m like, “No, I think that was a miracle. I think it was a miracle that I had no money and no reason to believe I could be super successful and yet something pushed me forward to say yes.”

And so, it’s just that little shift and for me, I was always afraid, I don’t want to get into that. I want to always deliver the idea of the miracle and I want to be in that space, but you have to be willing to see what that’s like for you. And so, what I would do is I would go to an evaluation and if I noticed it came out a little judgy and you can feel it. I think you can feel it if there’s good connection on the call, you feel it when it comes out, judgy, they experience it, judgy. The conversation, there’s a moment where you feel it.

So, I would go to my evaluation and be like, “What was I thinking in that moment? What happened there? How did I make that about me? What was I making it about me? And what do I need to do to not make it about me in the future? What do I need to tell myself? What emotion do I need to just be able to breathe into? How do I refocus myself?” And that intricate work was very powerful? I love it. Okay, so you also said, I learn and get so much value from each consult. Can we talk about that?

Sarah: Yeah, like I say, and you could see that in the results. The conversion rate is going up and that’s the power of the evaluation. If you do that, then it’s such a gift, there’s all that learning from every single one. And it’s not a really linear process, that I do kind of everything but one thing right in one and then I change that. Because everybody’s different, aren’t they? There’s an infinite number of people in the world and possibilities for things to come up.

So new things come up all the time and you’re just adding in additional learning, when this happens, this is how I would respond. So, from every consult, whether it’s a yes or a no, there’s always something to learn and to add into that, a bank of knowledge. This is how you want to approach things, who you want to be on the consult, how you want to respond to particular things.

Stacey: I think that’s so good is thinking about who you want to be on the consults, every time, getting clearer and clearer,. And when you do a consult, whether they sign or not, you have the opportunity to think back and say, “Did I do every minute of the consult in a way that I loved and was exactly who I want to be? And is there anything that I want to be different about the experience for me, about the experience for them?” And then going into that every time.

I used to think for every no I get, I want to make sure I get as much value as what money was on the table if they had signed. I want to make sure I get that level of value too.

Sarah: And I think no’s are much more valuable than the yeses because the learning is just so much greater. The first ever one was a yes, a really easy yes. And the second one was a no show. And the third was a no, awful. But that third one was the most valuable experience, I can barely remember the first one. I’m sure I did learn something from it, but I can’t tell you now what it is. But then the third one, I learned loads of things and above everything else that it’s fine for somebody to say no.

At the time, I really didn’t think that it was and I had all kinds of thoughts about, what if she tells other people, not that I did anything awful, but if it’s a no then she obviously has a poor opinion of me, and what if she tells other people. Which now just feels crazy but that’s what I thought. So, you just go through the experience.

Stacey: That’s so interesting. Yeah, because I think if you get more and more valuable with each consult, the way that you say. What I was thinking when you were talking is, even if they say no, they could easily know that that’s about them and still refer someone else to you. People do that all the time. My first client, I did free coaching for six weeks for 12 people and one of the people really wanted to coach with me. And eventually she did, two years later, she convinced her husband and maybe herself that she was going to do it.

But she had asked her husband and her husband said no. And she just couldn’t in her mind get past that but she loved the coaching and saw that it was very valuable for her. And so, she was telling her friend, “Oh my gosh, I’m on my way to have my call with my coach. I’m so excited.” And so, her friend’s asking her about it. Her friend reached out to me and ended up signing. And this is what I thought was really fascinating is she knew that I had been coaching her friend for free and she still signed up for a $5,000 coaching package so even that didn’t matter.

Sarah: And even if it is a no for them, I just don’t have the thought now that that’s a problem. I still think that it’s been a valuable experience for them that they got something from it. It’s absolutely no problem. It’s supposed to happen. There are supposed to be some people who are a no.

Stacey: Yeah. I also used to think, I want to know that they’re a no on the consult, not in the middle of a coaching relationship. Which is really interesting because some people think, job of overcoming objections, what you’re actually doing is convincing people to say yes or I have to get a yes otherwise I’m doing it wrong. I have to turn this into a yes. That’s what I’m supposed to be doing here. Versus the way that I think about it is I just want to make sure if you are a no, you love your reasons.

I want to make sure if you’re a no it’s because you don’t think it’s a good fit or because you decided, I see what is going to be required and I don’t want to do it and I’m actively choosing that and feel peace. Not I’m a no, and I’m sad because I want to be a yes, but I couldn’t believe in myself enough to be a yes and I feel disappointed versus proud because I’ve left the call feeling small about myself. That’s what I want to make sure. I want to make sure all of my no’s don’t come from that place.

And I think if you just give everything you’ve got for that aspect, I just want to make sure that it’s not you saying no to yourself because you don’t believe in yourself. If I can help you accomplish that, then everyone’s been served in that moment. I got better at my coaching, so I know the next person that it is right for. I’m going to show up better, and so that they can feel safer to say yes. But I also was able to serve that person at their highest level.

Even if they couldn’t get themselves to belief by the end of the call, or even by the end of a follow-up, that’s okay. I just want to fight for them if they want a change, I want to make sure I laid it all on the table for them, not for a yes. I think that’s the distinction.

Sarah: Yeah, for them.

Stacey: Yeah, so good. Okay, so tell me, we’ve talked about a lot of things. We obviously couldn’t get to all 20 in depth, but are there any others that you had kind of highlighted that you thought, I would love to touch more on this one or this is what I want to share with them. I think it’s very important for them to hear this. I’ve turned it over to you and your expert advice.

Sarah: Yeah. Well, the three themes that I pulled out, I think we have touched on all of them. And perhaps if I summarized that then that might be helpful. [Crosstalk] felt like, what were the most important things. The first one was making it simple, keeping it simple, deciding that it’s simple. And the second one was that it not being about me, so really having that focus on the client using the simple process whilst focused on the client.

I think that’s what’s made the most difference for me in terms of how I feel, who I’m being on the consult, that I’m just the same person as I am when I’m coaching. I’m just there focused completely on them. And then the other thing I had was that, I was trying to think what would be valuable if I hadn’t joined 2K and where would I be and what would I be thinking that would be different. And what came up for me was that I think I would be thinking that I was doing it all wrong, that it was going wrong and that it wasn’t working because not everybody was a yes.

And that sometimes people don’t turn up and sometimes people are a yes and then they change their mind and all of those things. I think if I wasn’t part of this program and this community and I didn’t have that awareness that that is part of the process and that’s how it’s supposed to work. I would just be thinking well, I’m obviously no good at this. I’m not cut out for this, it’s going terribly wrong.

Stacey: That’s so good. So, for anyone who is thinking about joining 2K or if you’re in 2K. Some people just skip past the intro module, talks about the eight phases of a coaching business and how most of those phases are no’s and it’s so powerful to know. And I really walk people through the experience of what it’s like now to sell things and how not everyone’s going to buy.

And that was the one leg up that I think I had going into it is because I always tell people, “You think it’s hard to hear no on the phone. Imagine hearing no from 100 people staring at you in person face-to-face. If you can do that for seven years, you can hear no on a call.” And so, I had already kind of been desensitized, I think from that in my prior industry and heard no’s in the not so nicest ways and the nicest. I’d heard all the versions of the no’s that you could possibly hear. But it never struck me that something’s gone wrong.

It was, some people are going to be yeses, and some people are going to be no’s. And the actual higher percentage of people will be the people that say no, not the ones that say yes.

Sarah: And actually, that’s how it works, that you need that and you evaluate and you keep going because otherwise how do you know what you’re doing right and what to do more of? You need that.

Stacey: Yes. It’s so funny to talk about now, but that’s why I got so good at selling infomercial products in department stores is you do 10 shows a day. And from the very beginning when I started, every show that I did not sell at least five of whatever I was selling, I called a trainer for help and we would dissect the show. I remember this, when we did the audition, they had said, they had talked about this company trip that you could win every year for the top salespeople. And I was just so bought in and sold, I’m going on that trip. I’m going to do whatever I have to do.

So, from day one, it was every day is a make or break of whether I go on this trip or not, every day, Tuesdays at one o’clock in a BJ’s membership club, make or break of whether I get to go to the Bahamas this year. And not in a negative way but I just took it every day as an opportunity in the store so seriously. And there were seven fundamentals of our sales pitch and every day I would go in, it didn’t matter what day it was and how many years I’d been in.

I would say, “Today’s the day I’m working on this one essential, this one fundamental and I’m going to work on it really hard. And I’m going to call for adjustments and I’m going to get help and I’m going to get better at this one thing.” And then I would become amazing at it in a product and what other people would do is they would get good at a product and they would want to stay on that product indefinitely. And they would only go to the cities that were selling that product.

And for me, I would get really, really good and then I would say, “Okay, send me to a different product.” And there would always be a learning curve and it’s with your own money because we were 100% commission. So, it would always take me up to a month to learn this new product and get the hang of that and then I would master selling that and then say “Okay, send me to the other product.” Because at the end of the day I wanted to be able to sell anything so I could go anywhere.

So, then I always got the best stores and everything I wanted. I was never a no for them. I’m like, “I know how to sell that. I know how to sell that. I know how to sell that.” But it got me so, so good at just the fundamentals of selling to humans. And I was thinking about what’s different about 2K, if you take out the process and what I actually teach and if you take out the coaching method that I use, if you took all of that out and said, “What’s different?”

I think that our commitment and the attention we put on evaluating, I don’t see that in any other coaching communities that I’m in as strongly as each time you do this, we’re going to evaluate so that you get more valuable. Your sales go up and you retain that knowledge forever.

Sarah: And it’s also what creates the comfort and the safety because it’s not, no, this has gone wrong and it’s awful. It’s okay, what happened? I have a process for dealing with this. And I just, I can see what was good. I can see what was wrong. And now I’ve moved forward. And so, it doesn’t have to be such a terrible thing.

Stacey: Yeah, that’s so good. I was coaching someone this week on 2K and I told her, she’d been struggling for many years in her business. And I said, “The only reason you feel this kind of hopelessness and defeat.” She was saying she felt traumatized by the no’s. The only reason why is because you’re not learning from each one of them. And because when you do the evaluation process the way I teach, if you do that, if that what you’re going to do differently is clear and specific and you believe it’s going to work, you want to get on that next consult as fast as possible to try it out.

I used to call it, throw up another show, I’d get off the adjustment call and be like, “I’m going to go throw up another show, I’ll call you right back.” But you want to do that because you’ve pushed yourself through the evaluation from defeat into empowerment and you’re excited to go do that again.

And so, I think that’s the point of all business failures just in general is we’re always picking ourselves back up and then empowering ourselves with this is what’s within my control when I’m failing. This is what I’m going to go do about it. This is the value waiting for me on the other side of figuring this out.

Sarah: It’s like a form of taking care of yourself just so it’s, I’m going to sit down and evaluate it. You’re just looking after yourself and giving yourself a way forward.

Stacey: Oh, my God, that’s so good.

Sarah: It’s so much nicer than feeling awful.

Stacey: Or I have to evaluate now because I failed.

Sarah: No, I always want to because I know I will feel better afterwards.

Stacey: Oh, that’s so good. It’s a form of self-care. No one’s ever said that ever before. That’s so good. Thank you for giving that thought. I love that. It’s not a punishment. It is a form of self-care to help yourself find a way forward. That’s so good. Thank you so much for coming and sharing. First of all, thank you for posting this in the group. I love good, meaty evaluations of what’s working so that everybody can learn from it and borrow your thoughts. So, I really appreciate you being a leader in the community and sharing when it’s working for you, being so generous.

Sarah: You’re welcome and thank you for inviting me. It was so nice to talk to you.

Stacey: Yeah. If anyone wants to reach out to you and they felt like this was so valuable to them and they want to thank you or they want to follow you or engage with you, how can they do that?

Sarah: So, you can find me on LinkedIn or Facebook @sarahhallcoaching. It’s Sarah with a H, sarahhallcoaching and that’s my website address as well so just everywhere is Sarah Hall.

Stacey: I love it. Sarah with an H. Yeah, thank you so much.

Sarah: You’re welcome. Thank you.

Stacey: Talk to you soon. Bye.

Sarah: Bye bye. 

Hey, if you are ready to make money as a life coach, I want to invite you to join my 2K for 2K program where you’re going to make your first 2,000 the hardest part and then 200,000 using my proven formula. It’s risk free, you either make your 2K or I give you your 2K back. Just head over to www.staceyboehman.com/2kfor2k. We’ll see you inside.